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Samantha Chen: Okay. Today is Tuesday, May 5 2020. My name is Samantha Chen interviewing Devang Shah as part of the Covid-19 Documentation Project.

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Samantha Chen: Do you consent to this interview being recorded and donated to Tufts Digital Collections and Archives in order to be made openly available online in the Tufts Digital Library?

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Devang Shah: Yes, I do.

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Samantha Chen: Okay, cool. And so we're gonna move on to our first questions. Can you tell me your affiliation with the school and what you're studying?

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Devang Shah: So I'm a graduate student at the Fletcher School of Law and Diplomacy and doing my Masters in Law and Diplomacy, Master of Arts in Law and Diplomacy. I'm about to graduate. I'm a second-year student.

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Samantha Chen: And how was the pandemic discussed and or handled in classes and extracurriculars before the campus closure?

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Devang Shah: Hmm. Like I feel the classes that I took uh...

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Devang Shah: It wasn't really discussed too much. Like it, like we were just like, yeah and that's why on the last day when the classes

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Devang Shah: were closed down, like I remember just casually going to the class like imagining that okay now there's going to be a spring break, and like after that, like normally the classes would go on.

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Devang Shah: But like the news about like everything closing down and Covid-19 like growing so much, it just came through emails and like the Dean telling us about it and like the administration telling but like

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Devang Shah: I don't remember any faculty actually discussing Covid-19 and that's probably because like the courses that I took, like they were not centered any way around that.

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Devang Shah: Yeah.

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Samantha Chen: And then how did you, so similarly you learned of the university's decision to close campus through email and from our school right?

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Devang Shah: Yeah.

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Samantha Chen: Okay. And then were you involved in any student organizations and if so, how did the pandemic affect those?

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Devang Shah: Um, not really. I feel like the last thing that I did was like my TED Talk that was like the last time I was involved in the TEDx team at Tufts and we were just like

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Devang Shah: right under the wire. Because like it happened on the eighth of March, so we didn't even know after that everything was going to be shut, because it was like 500 people in one auditorium. But

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Devang Shah: we were kind of relieved that we were able to execute it but also scared that, oh no we put so many people at risk. And then it just like, it just got over but besides that, no not really.

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Samantha Chen: Okay. And then before the pandemic, did you have a job and if so, what kind of work did you do and how was that affected?

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Devang Shah: So I did, I was also working for two faculties. For one faculty, I was working as like producer, director, editor, like I was making videos for her, for Professor Kim Wilson

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Devang Shah: called the Journeys Project. The good part was that before the pandemic had hit, I had done the shooting already.

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Devang Shah: And like all I had to do after the pandemic had hit was like just to sit in my room and edit. So, which could happen. The other faculty, I was a TA for Professor Cécile Aptel.

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Devang Shah: It was just, for her like things changed drastically because it was supposed to be a half semester module and like, usually the faculty teaches remotely but

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Devang Shah: in this case, like but she does come down for like three or four classes like to teach because she's based in Geneva. But like, when this happened like

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Devang Shah: a lot of changes had to be made because like even if it was remotely, it wasn't just like students were sitting in one room and

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Devang Shah: like, you know, having the conversation with the faculty. Like it was completely changed, the faculty had to be introduced to the entire Zoom concept, like she was in Geneva.

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Devang Shah: And like she is working like against Covid-19 because I think she's working for the Red Cross and WHO, so it was a lot of coordination that had to happen because of the time difference and getting all the students

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Devang Shah: at the same page to do it. But finally we were able to conduct the six classes that were initially planned to do, but a lot of flexibility had to be put into it.

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Samantha Chen: Yeah.

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Samantha Chen: And so adding on to that, what sorts of adjustments have you had to make to your usual routines due to these current restrictions?

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Devang Shah: Oh uh.

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Devang Shah: A lot, a lot of them.

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Devang Shah: To begin with, like, for example, I live in the university dorm Blakeley Hall. When it was decided that the campus is going to be shut and everything is going to be closed down, like we were told that

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Devang Shah: Blakeley Hall is also going to be shut and we were just given one week to, like you know, find another place to live.

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Devang Shah: And at that time, there was no clarity on like whether we will be refunded for like the next two months and like how living will actually pan out.

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Devang Shah: And especially for internationals like us, like it was really difficult because like they don't have relatives in the US or like we don't have any other places to go in the US.

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Devang Shah: So, that was a very complicated thing to handle at that time. And there were a lot of conversations that happened. Ultimately they did allow us to live where we are living right now, but we cannot use the common areas and the kitchen that was there.

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Devang Shah: So like a major change that has happened to my usual routine is like not being able to cook.

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Devang Shah: And I absolutely love to cook and I have to depend on like their dining hall for food which sometimes I am not very happy with because

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Devang Shah: they're not very good with vegetarian food.

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Devang Shah: And I'm a vegetarian so I don't know how many like how many proteins are actually going into my body right now. Besides that, like

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Devang Shah: just like the usual, like you know, even going to the gym and working out like that is now restricted to your room and you have to do inside your room workouts.

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Devang Shah: Interacting with your friends has now just become virtual, especially for like the people who are like, for example, I'm just living by myself over here.

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Devang Shah: So like I have absolutely nobody else to meet and like interactions within Blakely are also restricted, like we are not allowed to have groups of more than two people, in any room.

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Devang Shah: So we really actually cannot meet anyone so it has been now two months of actually not physically meeting anyone like in-person. Like it is just through virtual interactions and that

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Devang Shah: does take a toll on your mind a lot of times like that just makes you feel like very restricted and jailed at some level, so yeah.

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Samantha Chen: Okay, um.

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Samantha Chen: And then has there been anything new that you've had to add on with these restrictions? Like, is there something that you're doing now that you weren't doing before?

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Devang Shah: Of course, I feel that you know. There is a certain kind of, I will say extra consciousness that like, you know

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Devang Shah: like when you see such a kind of thing going around and when you see so many precautions like

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Devang Shah: being imposed on you and which are for good, like which are definitely for good.

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Devang Shah: Like you yourself become like very conscious like about like even meeting anyone or like, you know, going and like even shaking hands with anyone like you just don't do it.

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Devang Shah: Right now I'm very paranoid, even if I go to the dining hall or like if I'm- if I'm going anywhere like I will wipe my hands like several times with

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Devang Shah: the disinfectant. like those things will happen, like cleaning my room much more, becoming conscious of everything that I'm touching, being very conscious of anybody that I'm around with.

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Devang Shah: And what's scary about this idea is that once this, all of this, ends as gradually as it will be

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Devang Shah: the idea is like, I don't know how long will it take to

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Devang Shah:  take this out of like my mind. Like, you know, take the idea of like now actually going to meet like more than like three or four people in a group or actually going and like

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Devang Shah: I don't know, hugging someone like all of that. I don't know. When will that actually happen because now there's like this internal like I'm like always scared. Like there's always this internal fear that oh no, like I shouldn't be touching anyone.

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Samantha Chen: Yeah.

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Samantha Chen: Have you been able to get like enough supplies and stuff, because I don't know if Blakeley is supplying you with like you know, cleaning supplies or anything like that? Like masks?

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Devang Shah: No.

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Devang Shah: Like you have to go and get it.

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Devang Shah: Like

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Devang Shah: they are like $2 each so they are pretty expensive. And you can just like use them for like once or twice because they are time limited to four hours.

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Devang Shah: So it's, it is an especially like now, for example, like no matter what, I have to go to the dining hall every day and I have to wear a new mask every day.

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Devang Shah: So it's like a toll on that particular part where like, you know, you have to go and buy your own things and

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Devang Shah: all the cleaning supplies as well. Like one thing that I would say that's good about Tufts, is like they did give us a few free meals at the dining hall to go and get them.

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Devang Shah: So we can go and get some free food for like I think 15 days, which is about to end. But besides that, as long as like disinfectants and the cleaning, it's your own supplies, you walk to Davis Square and you get it, get your own stuff.

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Samantha Chen: Okay.

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Samantha Chen: Um, and then I think you might have already touched upon this, but if you want to elaborate a little bit more, how do you think the pandemic has affected your relationships with others?

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Devang Shah: Well, like.

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Devang Shah: Of course like in terms of like how it has affected, I like to believe that nothing has changed in terms of like actual relationships with people like because

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Devang Shah: it's- it's relativity, right like everybody's going through the same thing. It's like, it's not just me and everybody, like you can definitely connect and talk to them through Zoom. So like

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Devang Shah: there is nothing happening on a personal scale, but it's just the idea of like how will it be when everything again opens up and like you know, when you're again actually allowed to meet people without masks.

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Devang Shah: So how like, right now it's even difficult to imagine like how would that actually look like.

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Devang Shah: So, yeah.

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Samantha Chen: Yeah, okay. Um, how do you think technology has played a role in your life during this pandemic either in classes, as a way to get information, or for entertainment?

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Devang Shah: Well, technology has definitely played a huge, huge role, like I cannot imagine right now if my internet goes away what would I do?

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Devang Shah: Yeah, it is. It is major like in terms of just having online meetings and like

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Devang Shah: having like of course classes like thanks to Zoom we did have. It was definitely not the same experience as sitting in a classroom and interacting with the faculty and interacting with the

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Devang Shah: entire like batch of like 30-40 students that are sitting with you in the class, but it was still something. It was still

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Devang Shah: like we were able to pull it off rather than just like ending everything. Like you know, rather than just not doing it.

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Samantha Chen: Yeah.

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Devang Shah: very good. And in terms of like, for example, initially my plan was to like shift to LA for some time to like network, but like I can do that networking over here. Like I can, anyway if I shift to LA as well like, nobody's going to meet me in person.

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Devang Shah: So might as well just like be over here and just like you know interact with people on Skype or like Zoom.

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Devang Shah: So I feel that yeah technology has played a massive role and like I know there are many places in the world that are restricting Internet, which I'm completely against because I know what I would like. I would be very desperate with our Internet right now.

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Samantha Chen: Yeah, definitely.

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Samantha Chen: Um, along with classes, how did your classes and how are your finals going? And then what sorts of messages have you received from professors?

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Devang Shah: So the classes

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Devang Shah: did go well. Like my finals are over, the finals were also pretty great.

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Devang Shah: I think all of my finals were just exams. So like, what the faculties did that that was good was like since students were in different time zones, they extended the time like instead of 24 hours students could submit in 36 hours or something.

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Devang Shah: So there was a lot of leniency, and there was like a lot of comfort in like doing those things.

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Devang Shah: So yeah. Like, I feel that as far as exams and studies were concerned like that everything was pretty smooth.

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Devang Shah: And professors, I feel like they were very, very cooperative with like the entire thing like they would be recording their Zoom sessions, they would be uploading it

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Devang Shah: it in case you are in a different time zone and cannot watch it. If you are sending them emails they are very very responsive to all the questions. Like it just, it has been good.

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Devang Shah: No complaints.

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Samantha Chen: Okay. Um, do you know how other students are handling the changes?

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Devang Shah: I actually don't. Like because if I, if I do end up talking to anyone on Zoom like this is something that we avoid to talk about.

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Devang Shah: Because it's just like, it's just like you know once in a while you actually get to speak to someone and like you don't really want to discuss Covid-19 at that time because it just like makes a very grim conversation after that.

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Samantha Chen: Okay. Understandable. Well then, how are you handling it?

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Devang Shah: Not too bad. I would say that it really hasn't, like I don't know how long will this be stretched like I'm guessing like right now we are peaking so

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Devang Shah: from now on, like we should be going down. So thankfully, I would say that I am privileged enough to like it hasn't hit me that strongly so like I am handling it pretty well. So yeah, like, not too bad. Of course, like I've been impacted but like nothing too major.

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Samantha Chen: Okay. And then, how have your academic routines changed, like housing in your room and then also having to do all the different types of work and school that you usually do elsewhere, how has that changed for you?

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Devang Shah: I do of course, miss having the library because with me, what happened is that when the entire like shut down was announced- and like when it was announced that the university is going to close down- the first thing that I did was I went and returned all my library books-

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Samantha Chen: mmhmm.

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Devang Shah: -which I felt that I shouldn't have because like now there are these provisions by which we can return. So I should have kept those books with me because that would have helped me with my Capstone.

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Samantha Chen: Yeah

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Devang Shah: But like I thought that if I don't return them I would be fined. So, I immediately went and returned all of the books that I had.

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Devang Shah: So...

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Devang Shah: So I wish, I wish I would have kept the books back with me. So that's like a major change of like actually having access to books. Yes of course we have access, to like all the internet mediums, but

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Devang Shah: having actual books that I've been so far using for my Capstone and like for my talk and everything like, I don't have them now so I don't know how to reference them.

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Samantha Chen: Oh no!

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Samantha Chen: Okay.

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Samantha Chen: Um, and then kind of going back to a little bit earlier, but how are you feeling mentally and or physically?

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Devang Shah: Hmm mentally, I would say, like, of course it has impacted.

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Devang Shah: Like there are like if you if you end up sitting in one room all day like it does hit you at some point.

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Devang Shah:  Even if, like, you know going outside like there is nobody to see like, you know, you're not in right so like, it certainly feels very restricted very especially like the place that we live in like Medford.

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Devang Shah: It is for the last two or three days, like the weather has been

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Devang Shah: still decent, but otherwise, like the weather is so bad that it cannot be just like you're going out on a stroll and you're just like walking around.

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Devang Shah: So you know, it's so it is definitely like sometimes in the evenings like it does make your mind a little bit depressed and gloomy and the things that

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Devang Shah: you usually don't worry about you end up worrying about and panicking about them even more like given especially like being in this state, where we are graduating right now and the entire job market is like

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Devang Shah: on a complete shutdown.

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Devang Shah: Yeah, we do know that this is something that's not happening just in US, like it's happening worldwide and like there's absolutely nothing that you can do about it. But, that still makes you very worried about the fact that

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Devang Shah: oh no, like what's next?

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Devang Shah: Because I'm like, I have received like already two mails from like

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Devang Shah: two jobs which were like my dream, dream jobs. I was interviewed for them

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Devang Shah: and they said that they had removed the position altogether because of the economic cuts due to the Covid-19 crisis. And these are like big companies that are doing this.

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Devang Shah: And I don't blame them for doing it. But at the same time, it just feels like so what job will I do next? Like what awaits me?

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Samantha Chen: Yeah.

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Devang Shah: there is a very high chance for you to spiral down that hole.

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Samantha Chen: Yeah.

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Samantha Chen: Um.

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Samantha Chen: Um, in addition to like job worries, do you also have like housing worries? Because I know Blakely is only allowing you to stay until the end of July right?

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Devang Shah: So technically, till the end of 20th of May.

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Devang Shah: That's the contract initially and then after that we can choose to extend. So like the extension also comes with its own cost.

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Devang Shah: Uh... but I'm just trying to figure out, because right now that cost is pretty similar to like cost that's being offered by all the other places that I live around.

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Devang Shah: So like it's, I'm- and those places have kitchen. So I'm planning to trying to make a shift rather than continuing to stay in Blakely because to maintain my sanity I need good food at least. So I will, I will make the shift.

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Samantha Chen: Good.

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Samantha Chen: Um, and then so how are your friends, your family, your partner or other important people in their life, in your life, how are they doing?

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Devang Shah: Friends, I like to assume they're doing well as like as far as their Instagram is concerned. Like I know that you have been cooking a lot, which I envy a lot. As much as I love your cooking

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Devang Shah: I really envy it.

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Devang Shah: Family is family is also good, like they're all at home. My mom is like, my mom has, my mom is on immunosuppressants like she has an autoimmune disorder of the lungs.

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Devang Shah: So like she's a very high risk patient. So like currently you guys are on a lockdown and I'm very happy that she is inside the house and like she is not going anywhere.

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Devang Shah: But it's definitely like you're scared about them right, like, because they can be infected at any time. My partner is fine. My partner is also working from home. Finally, his country started taking it seriously. So, so, yeah, that's okay. Yeah that's that's pretty much it.

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Samantha Chen: Okay, um so moving on to a few, a little bit broader questions. Um, what are your impressions of the media coverage of the pandemic both currently and also before it arrived in the US?

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Devang Shah: Oh. Um...

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Devang Shah: Wow like, that is like we could do a one-hour interview just on that.

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Devang Shah: In fact, like my partner is actually writing an article on just on this.

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Devang Shah: Yeah he's writing an article. I think he has already sent it to a few places to get it published like if anybody selects them, but I love the article.

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Devang Shah: And which I strongly agree with, like which is- where he's talking about and what I agree with is also like how the coverage of this pandemic has been...

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Devang Shah: I don't know, like

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Devang Shah: not just sensationalistic but also deeply colonial.

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Devang Shah: Like you know, you do see um.

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Devang Shah: like you do see a lot of bias towards like say, first of all, against China and like you know how China has been relayed to even brand China as like this entire manufacturer of this virus and everything. And then

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Devang Shah: you think about like currently like New York has seen more cases than like Wuhan ever did. But like

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Devang Shah: you don't see New York the same way we see Wuhan. Like you know and why is that? So it's, it is that idea like, you know, why do we like- why is the coverage always centered around like how these

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Devang Shah: Western superpowers are actually dealing with these things. And like, the mistakes that they're making are seen as like a flaw in policy? Whereas like

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Devang Shah: if the same spread were to happen in like the Global South, like it would have been seen in a much more negative connotation. Like so... yeah, I-I have not been very impressed by the way the media is handling the entire pandemic.

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Samantha Chen: Um, I don't know if you're getting the Somerville 311 updates. Um, do you-if you are? Do you know what those are?

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Devang Shah: No.

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Samantha Chen: Somerville residents.

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Devang Shah: Okay.

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Samantha Chen: If you haven't been looking at it, it's fine.

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Devang Shah: And do you know how do we sign up for that?

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Samantha Chen: Yeah, I'll send you a link.

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Samantha Chen: Okay uh...

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Samantha Chen: So how have your plans changed for the near future and what were you planning to do for the summer that is now uncertain?

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Devang Shah: Ah, oh God! This is, this is a very, oh my god, like I don't know how to answer this question.

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Devang Shah: I think I feel for the near future, of course, a lot has changed because um...

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Devang Shah: the entire OPT application for me and like for me to like, even like the idea of like even working in the US for like the next one year which was

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Devang Shah: which was something that the American government promises us so that we actually come to study in the US.

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Devang Shah: So, which is like, right now like somewhere in the air and like there are being articles which like Trump is saying that he will be cancelling OPT

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Devang Shah: which is which is very heartbreaking and which is very, very not- not just heartbreaking, but which is very deceptive. Like, I feel at some level, because

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Devang Shah: we are- we are spending like hundreds of thousands of dollars to like actually be over here and then like you're actually not giving us what you promised. So it just feels like

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Devang Shah: a bargain that didn't go well. So, of course I've started looking for jobs like that are more like I've started looking for jobs outside US, like back in India as well.

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Devang Shah: So, yeah.

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Devang Shah: A lot has changed according to that. And as I told you earlier like initially I was planning to move to like either New York or LA or DC, like to go and network but now I'll be in Medford.

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Devang Shah: and networking from here. So yeah, that's the big change.

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Samantha Chen: Um, along with that, has this affected like your visa at all? Do you have to pay attention to that right now or is that still okay?

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Devang Shah: Not that I know of like it just like you may never trust Trump like he might just come up with something overnight and then see.

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Devang Shah: But like yeah... like as long as I know, like, no, like, I'm still on a student visa at least till August. So like, yeah, so

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Devang Shah: nothing has changed for me per se. But like I do know that now there are like these evacuation strategies that are being planned out by the Indian government.

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Devang Shah: And there was some like collaboration between the Indian government and like the US government about the students that are here currently. So, if the Indian government decides to have a lockdown for a longer period, which currently it is so right now nobody's allowed in India, even Indians.

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Devang Shah:  So... um like those Indian students over here are allowed to stay like even for longer periods.

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Devang Shah: But like now like the Indian government is starting with evacuation plans and like taking the students out from here. So yeah, I don't know exactly how that is playing out.

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Samantha Chen: Okay.

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Samantha Chen: So those are all questions that I had. Is there anything else you would like people to know about your situation?

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Devang Shah: I guess that covers most of it like yeah, I just want this to end as soon as possible and see what the new thing awaits us.

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Devang Shah: Like and I-I'd just like to say like as grim and like as traumatizing as like this entire experience is, and it is worse for some people than

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Devang Shah: me as a person who is speaking over here

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Devang Shah: but I do feel that a lot of us just should keep hope towards the fact that something new has to come out of this. And like, we should just like keep a lookout towards what is the new that is supposed to come out.

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Devang Shah: Like it won't be like returning to the normal, it would be something new and we just have to figure out what that new is.

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Samantha Chen: Okay. Well, thank you so much for speaking with us.

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Devang Shah: Thank you.